Non-native degree Teachers vs non-degree Teachers

[Wendy1969]

I wish to highlight the many often irrational demand by some countries in Asia who insist on teachers having degrees even though the quality of their degrees and their proficiency in English is noted to be highly questionable. Some non-native teachers with degrees are known to have too many mistakes in their spoken and written English despite they having some sort of degree.

I think the priority is to improve the standard of spoken and written English and improve the standard of TEFL rather than require teachers to have a degree.

[Josef Essberger]

Typically in Asian countries, and for teaching English in language schools (not universities), the degree requirement is a government requirement for getting a work permit. It is often not a requirement of the employer and has little to do with ability to teach English. Indeed, the degree can often be in any subject.

[Wendy1969]

Typically in Asian countries, and for teaching English in language schools (not universities), the degree requirement is a government requirement for getting a work permit. It is often not a requirement of the employer and has little to do with ability to teach English. Indeed, the degree can often be in any subject.

It should be up to the schools to require a degree, diploma or a certificate in teaching the various levels of English language. I noted some private schools in Asia do not see TEFL certification as a requirement to teach English. A high quality TEFL certification with a passion for English language - should be made a requirement to teach English to non-native students in Asia.

[eggshell]

The quality of a teacher's English and their training should definitely be prioritized over just having any degree. I completely agree that schools should focus on TEFL certification and language proficiency over arbitrary degree requirements. A passion for teaching English and proper teaching skills can be so important for students. Hopefully more schools will follow the approach of recognizing certifications rather than degrees alone.

[John V55]

I think the problems lie in comparisons. If you’re in the west would you want your child to be taught by someone who just sort of turns up without formal qualifications? Those who aren’t native speakers will always struggle with grammar and so the jobs they’ll get are in the private sector and not the state schools and where they run into all sorts of scams and trouble.

[Wendy1969]

I think the problems lie in comparisons. If you’re in the west would you want your child to be taught by someone who just sort of turns up without formal qualifications? Those who aren’t native speakers will always struggle with grammar and so the jobs they’ll get are in the private sector and not the state schools and where they run into all sorts of scams and trouble.

A good TEFL certification qualification that is accredited by professional TEFL organisation is a formal qualification as well. Nowadays, there are some excellent micro-credentials or specialised short courses that one can take to improve our English as well as teaching skills. I think the problem here is many non-native speakers of English in Asia do not have the right attitude towards English language being a global language or towards running a school or a class. Furthermore, many of them are bilinguals and not that focus on English language. They may have a degree but their professionalism and English skills is highly questionable.

[Wendy1969]

I think the problems lie in comparisons. If you’re in the west would you want your child to be taught by someone who just sort of turns up without formal qualifications? Those who aren’t native speakers will always struggle with grammar and so the jobs they’ll get are in the private sector and not the state schools and where they run into all sorts of scams and trouble.

If I were in the West, I would still prefer a highly skilled professional native English speakers or a highly skilled professional who considers English as her/his first language. Of course some people may need more formal qualifications to boost their morales or resumes.
The problem is many places in Asia are mostly bilinguals and really not focus on teaching English as the global language.

[John V55]

I think the problems lie in comparisons. If you’re in the west would you want your child to be taught by someone who just sort of turns up without formal qualifications? Those who aren’t native speakers will always struggle with grammar and so the jobs they’ll get are in the private sector and not the state schools and where they run into all sorts of scams and trouble.

A good TEFL certification qualification that is accredited by professional TEFL organisation is a formal qualification as well. Nowadays, there are some excellent micro-credentials or specialised short courses that one can take to improve our English as well as teaching skills. I think the problem here is many non-native speakers of English in Asia do not have the right attitude towards English language being a global language or towards running a school or a class. Furthermore, many of them are bilinguals and not that focus on English language. They may have a degree but their professionalism and English skills is highly questionable.

Those not native English speakers will always struggle with grammar. I can already spot your mistakes in your post. The people interviewing you will also spot them and why many schools insist on NES.

Perhaps it’s different elsewhere, but I worked for many years in Asia and China. No one cared where the TEFL certificate had come from as unless the director of the school was a foreigner they’d probably never heard of the company. What all the schools I worked in were interested in was a degree and some experience. TEFL was simply an indicator that the applicant had reached a basic level and all required a sample teaching lesson before being let loose on their own in a classroom.

[Wendy1969]

I think the problems lie in comparisons. If you’re in the west would you want your child to be taught by someone who just sort of turns up without formal qualifications? Those who aren’t native speakers will always struggle with grammar and so the jobs they’ll get are in the private sector and not the state schools and where they run into all sorts of scams and trouble.

A good TEFL certification qualification that is accredited by professional TEFL organisation is a formal qualification as well. Nowadays, there are some excellent micro-credentials or specialised short courses that one can take to improve our English as well as teaching skills. I think the problem here is many non-native speakers of English in Asia do not have the right attitude towards English language being a global language or towards running a school or a class. Furthermore, many of them are bilinguals and not that focus on English language. They may have a degree but their professionalism and English skills is highly questionable.

Those not native English speakers will always struggle with grammar. I can already spot your mistakes in your post. The people interviewing you will also spot them and why many schools insist on NES.

Perhaps it’s different elsewhere, but I worked for many years in Asia and China. No one cared where the TEFL certificate had come from as unless the director of the school was a foreigner they’d probably never heard of the company. What all the schools I worked in were interested in was a degree and some experience. TEFL was simply an indicator that the applicant had reached a basic level and all required a sample teaching lesson before being let loose on their own in a classroom.

What is the point that you are trying to make? I too noted my mistakes after having submitted my post - due to the fact I did not proofread my posts and was in a hurry to reply to your post. Anyway, this post is just a post in reply to your post and not for teaching purposes.
Anyway, I can understand why some schools insist on NES (?Native English Speakers) in Asia but the fact is too many schools in Asia have only or mostly (unqualified) non-native English speakers teaching English in Asia.

[Wendy1969]

I think the problems lie in comparisons. If you’re in the west would you want your child to be taught by someone who just sort of turns up without formal qualifications? Those who aren’t native speakers will always struggle with grammar and so the jobs they’ll get are in the private sector and not the state schools and where they run into all sorts of scams and trouble.

A good TEFL certification qualification that is accredited by professional TEFL organisation is a formal qualification as well. Nowadays, there are some excellent micro-credentials or specialised short courses that one can take to improve our English as well as teaching skills. I think the problem here is many non-native speakers of English in Asia do not have the right attitude towards English language being a global language or towards running a school or a class. Furthermore, many of them are bilinguals and not that focus on English language. They may have a degree but their professionalism and English skills is highly questionable.

Those not native English speakers will always struggle with grammar. I can already spot your mistakes in your post. The people interviewing you will also spot them and why many schools insist on NES.

Perhaps it’s different elsewhere, but I worked for many years in Asia and China. No one cared where the TEFL certificate had come from as unless the director of the school was a foreigner they’d probably never heard of the company. What all the schools I worked in were interested in was a degree and some experience. TEFL was simply an indicator that the applicant had reached a basic level and all required a sample teaching lesson before being let loose on their own in a classroom.

What is the point that you are trying to make? I too noted my mistakes after having submitted my post - due to the fact I did not proofread my posts and was in a hurry to reply to your post. Anyway, this post is just a post in reply to your post and not for teaching purposes.
Anyway, I can understand why some schools insist on NES (?Native English Speakers) in Asia but the fact is too many schools in Asia have only or mostly (unqualified) non-native English speakers teaching English in Asia.

[Wendy1969]

Anyway, a basic TEFL certificate is often inadequate if one were to teach a higher level of English proficiency.
One can continue to proceed to acquire more hours of specialised TELF related studies or acquire more advanced TEFL related credentials and have the credits accumulated - that would be equivalent to a degree level of studies.

[Wendy1969]

Furthermore, a degree does not guarantee one would be a good English teacher. Teaching English is about having natural native English skills, creativity, patience, professionalism and having excellent communication skills.

[John V55]

What is the point that you are trying to make? I too noted my mistakes after having submitted my post - due to the fact I did not proofread my posts and was in a hurry to reply to your post. Anyway, this post is just a post in reply to your post and not for teaching purposes.
Anyway, I can understand why some schools insist on NES (?Native English Speakers) in Asia but the fact is too many schools in Asia have only or mostly (unqualified) non-native English speakers teaching English in Asia.

You shouldn’t need to proof read a short post, it should come naturally. The schools in Asia that employ teachers without degrees are the private ones. State schools overseen by an education department will insist on them. Try getting a teaching job in the UK for instance without a degree or PGCE.

My point is that your best bet is to get a professional teaching qualification if you want teaching as a career. Second best is a degree and a TEFL and lastly at the bottom end of private schools is a basic TEFL certificate, but it’s where the scams come from. That’s just the way it works in real life.

[Wendy1969]

What is the point that you are trying to make? I too noted my mistakes after having submitted my post - due to the fact I did not proofread my posts and was in a hurry to reply to your post. Anyway, this post is just a post in reply to your post and not for teaching purposes.
Anyway, I can understand why some schools insist on NES (?Native English Speakers) in Asia but the fact is too many schools in Asia have only or mostly (unqualified) non-native English speakers teaching English in Asia.

You shouldn’t need to proof read a short post, it should come naturally. The schools in Asia that employ teachers without degrees are the private ones. State schools overseen by an education department will insist on them. Try getting a teaching job in the UK for instance without a degree or PGCE.

My point is that your best bet is to get a professional teaching qualification if you want teaching as a career. Second best is a degree and a TEFL and lastly at the bottom end of private schools is a basic TEFL certificate, but it’s where the scams come from. That’s just the way it works in real life.

Sometimes, typos happened - the kind of mistakes that should have been auto-corrected. Of course, I am keen to further expand on my professional TEFL related teaching qualifications and keen to acquire more professional TEFL related teaching qualifications/certifications that would be equivalent to a professional degree. I hope to acquire more CEU credits that would lead towards a professional degree.

[John V55]

Wendy, a TEFL certificate is not a professional teaching qualification, nor does it have any academic relation to a degree. It’s the basic bottom end of teaching and if you pay your money you get the certificate. It’s that easy. You can’t earn a degree collecting certificates.

I hope I’m not rubbing you up the wrong way and you take this personally, but a TEFL certificate is what many backpackers use to fund their travels. You want a professional teaching degree, or a degree in anything? Go and do years of study because there are no short cuts.

Treat TEFL as an adventure, visit exotic (and some not so exotic) places and earn money whilst you’re doing it, but without a degree and a non-NES you will be at the bottom end of private school teaching and the people employing you will know it.

Believe me Wendy, no school principle is going to be jumping up and down in excitement at the thought of employing a non-NES, without a degree, with limited or no experience and just a TEFL certificate. Try to get a job, get the experience to put on your CV, but don’t treat a TEFL certificate as some sort of professional qualification because it’s not.
Off for two weeks holiday, but if there's anything you want to ask about what I've said, I'll reply when I get back.